06-11-2015, 06:34 PM
Inspired by the last unfortunate thread.I would like to give you my thoughts on High End watches.Let us all please just stick to the subject this time.We can all learn from a debate,and i am just as interested in learning something new as i am sure,we all are.
My thoughts on this subject involve going back in time,and learning about the history of a few brands.Vacheron Constantin is a good place to start being the oldest continuous brand in existence.In the thirtys and forties this brand was the most prestigious in the world,with Patek at no.2.VC watches were found on the arms of most of the Royalty and super rich world wide.Patek later took the crown from VC,but that is another story.
These two brands have been considered to be high end almost from day one.And they have so much in common.They both wanted to build watches with the highest standards of handwork and finish,without any compromise.They both used traditional methods of finishing ex. handpolishing beveled edges etc etc.Each watch made by them was of a standard that few in the industry could match.And here comes the amusing bit.Most of these watches were built with the help of other brands,and independant watchmakers.'
The cases were nearly all made out of house.The bracelets were made out of house.The basic calibers were made out of house.The complications were developed in and out of house.There is nothing out of the ordinary with this.Because this is how the Swiss Watch industry has been making watches for over two hundred years! What made PP and VC stand out was their almost fanatical attention to quality and detail.This is also what made Rolex
They demanded that only the very best the industry could offer,would be allowed to work on their watches.In reality they sub contracted a large quantity of the work,out of house.Philippe Dufour is just one of many independants that did work for Patek.This is how watches were made in the Swiss alps.Forget inhouse and all such fantasy,it did not exist then,and does not with the exception of two brands exist today.
It is worth noting that in the year 1840,Vacheron changed their Tool set up,to make interchangeable calibers.This was really the beginning of the industrial production of calibers.And nearly the end of what is called Artisan watchmaking.
Time is short,so i will skip to the present day.You would really need to write a book to give a true picture of the tradition that exists in the watch industry.Today brands like Patek and VC just like most other brands in the High End section are more independent and out scource less work and parts to others.They also produce many more watches than they did 30-40 years ago.Production is industrilised,and instead of one man sitting down and hand finishing a caliber,it is today a production line method that is used.One person polishes the same part of a caliber all of the time.Then all the parts are put together by people who do nothing else.Rutine work like this is the only way possible to make the numbers of watches sold by these brands.It is the same system used by the Royal Copenhagen factory,where i once painted or making parts for a Rolls Royce.Repetition makes you good and fast.Lange in a recent film showed a woman who polished one little part of a caliber to perfection with a traditional piece of Wood tool,everyday.So i hope we can forget once and for all,the idea of a little hunchback watchmaker stooped over his bench making the next piece of art.
So what happened to all the clever watchmakers who used to sub contract to the big brands like Patek-VC-AP-Cartier etc etc? Well some of them are still doing this ,but many more of these highly skilled people have started their own brands.Parmigiani-Dornbluth-Journe et etc.There are just so many of these young talanted watchmakers,that again you could write a book about them.The more independent brands like Patek and VC became,the more independent watch brands developed.And this is why i think you can argue that the finishing and development of a high end watch is not just a god given right for the likes of Patek-VC-Lange etc etc.We could argue best finish until the dogs come home.And because you are a brand with history,this proves nothing.VC had terrible quality problems a few years ago,as did Blancpain and Frank Muller.So lets forget the idea that some brands cannot do any wrong.
You could indeed argue that a hand finished watch by a small independent watchmaker is more in the tradition of a Artisan watch.And more of a piece of art,than a watch finished by maybe 50 different hands.Let us forget branding here,or future Investment or prestige value,because these things have got nothing to do with the essence of watchmaking.
Sorry this is a bit of a mish mash of parts.But it would take one person for ever,just to go deeper into this.There are many brands and watchmakers i could have named.But i hope you have an idea about what i mean.And it would be nice to hear from others,about their views on this.
PS.Would you call these watches super super high end https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/with-t...nd-ferrier
Or would you say a Omega caliber is more high end than a Rolex caliber because of the finish.The possibilitys are endless.
My thoughts on this subject involve going back in time,and learning about the history of a few brands.Vacheron Constantin is a good place to start being the oldest continuous brand in existence.In the thirtys and forties this brand was the most prestigious in the world,with Patek at no.2.VC watches were found on the arms of most of the Royalty and super rich world wide.Patek later took the crown from VC,but that is another story.
These two brands have been considered to be high end almost from day one.And they have so much in common.They both wanted to build watches with the highest standards of handwork and finish,without any compromise.They both used traditional methods of finishing ex. handpolishing beveled edges etc etc.Each watch made by them was of a standard that few in the industry could match.And here comes the amusing bit.Most of these watches were built with the help of other brands,and independant watchmakers.'
The cases were nearly all made out of house.The bracelets were made out of house.The basic calibers were made out of house.The complications were developed in and out of house.There is nothing out of the ordinary with this.Because this is how the Swiss Watch industry has been making watches for over two hundred years! What made PP and VC stand out was their almost fanatical attention to quality and detail.This is also what made Rolex
They demanded that only the very best the industry could offer,would be allowed to work on their watches.In reality they sub contracted a large quantity of the work,out of house.Philippe Dufour is just one of many independants that did work for Patek.This is how watches were made in the Swiss alps.Forget inhouse and all such fantasy,it did not exist then,and does not with the exception of two brands exist today.It is worth noting that in the year 1840,Vacheron changed their Tool set up,to make interchangeable calibers.This was really the beginning of the industrial production of calibers.And nearly the end of what is called Artisan watchmaking.
Time is short,so i will skip to the present day.You would really need to write a book to give a true picture of the tradition that exists in the watch industry.Today brands like Patek and VC just like most other brands in the High End section are more independent and out scource less work and parts to others.They also produce many more watches than they did 30-40 years ago.Production is industrilised,and instead of one man sitting down and hand finishing a caliber,it is today a production line method that is used.One person polishes the same part of a caliber all of the time.Then all the parts are put together by people who do nothing else.Rutine work like this is the only way possible to make the numbers of watches sold by these brands.It is the same system used by the Royal Copenhagen factory,where i once painted or making parts for a Rolls Royce.Repetition makes you good and fast.Lange in a recent film showed a woman who polished one little part of a caliber to perfection with a traditional piece of Wood tool,everyday.So i hope we can forget once and for all,the idea of a little hunchback watchmaker stooped over his bench making the next piece of art.
So what happened to all the clever watchmakers who used to sub contract to the big brands like Patek-VC-AP-Cartier etc etc? Well some of them are still doing this ,but many more of these highly skilled people have started their own brands.Parmigiani-Dornbluth-Journe et etc.There are just so many of these young talanted watchmakers,that again you could write a book about them.The more independent brands like Patek and VC became,the more independent watch brands developed.And this is why i think you can argue that the finishing and development of a high end watch is not just a god given right for the likes of Patek-VC-Lange etc etc.We could argue best finish until the dogs come home.And because you are a brand with history,this proves nothing.VC had terrible quality problems a few years ago,as did Blancpain and Frank Muller.So lets forget the idea that some brands cannot do any wrong.
You could indeed argue that a hand finished watch by a small independent watchmaker is more in the tradition of a Artisan watch.And more of a piece of art,than a watch finished by maybe 50 different hands.Let us forget branding here,or future Investment or prestige value,because these things have got nothing to do with the essence of watchmaking.
Sorry this is a bit of a mish mash of parts.But it would take one person for ever,just to go deeper into this.There are many brands and watchmakers i could have named.But i hope you have an idea about what i mean.And it would be nice to hear from others,about their views on this.
PS.Would you call these watches super super high end https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/with-t...nd-ferrier
Or would you say a Omega caliber is more high end than a Rolex caliber because of the finish.The possibilitys are endless.
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